No MIDI out via IAC?

Question

Cheers all,

I have a timeline for a violin/video piece that has a series of MIDIOutputEventsInBytes that I use to trigger various clips and processes in an external app with MIDI sent out via IAC. It’s been rock solid for quite some time on Pacarana.

It continued to work on Pacamara until this week, but now any MIDI sent via IAC isn't being seen by the video app. It's as if the port is off...

As a test, I tried sending MIDI note and cc messages from Kyma via IAC to Max and Max didn't see anything either.

IAC does work with other apps sending MIDI to the video software. I went back to the Pacarana to check and it’s doing the same thing now… I also tried it on 2 different computers with the same setup and no luck either.

Nothing has changed in my setup or the timeline, and everything is current Kyma 7++ and firmware-wise - the only change I can think of was the Feb 18 update…

Mac M1 Studio (and M2 Laptop) OSX Sonoma 14.3.1
Pacamara -> Audio Interface via USBC; Pacamara -> computer via ethernet - same as I used with Pacarana.

Running KymaConnect 2 and it reports everything is green and ok - and sees the Pacamara as beslime-mara-xxxx.

DSP Status Window shows Audio I/O interface, but MIDI I/O is showing Silent Device as the only option (although my understanding is that this is for hardware controllers/interfaces etc).

In OSX Audio/MIDI setup does see the Pacamara but it’s greyed out and I cannot bring it online. I assume this is also for a hardware configuration as opposed to virtual.

Probably a setting I’m missing, but I’m stumped.

Thanks always,

Mark

Comments

If you connect your Pacamara to the host via USB-C and set the MIDI Input/Ouput to Host USB (in DSP Status window), then, to the video software, the Pacamara will appear as an audio interface that has MIDI input/output and you should be able to select it as the MIDI source.

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Yes - this works like a charm. Just initially baffled on the IAC side.

Answer 1

UPDATE:

wrestled with it a bit and as far as I can see it looks like it's KymaConnect unfortunately... although it does show the virtual ports and everything is green - but no data passed. Perhaps it's Apple time has come?

Using Pacamara as host USB for MIDI and also redoing the timeline with OSC messaging all works as advertised.

IAC did make a few things convenient... if I missed anything, do let me know.

Cheers,

MZ~

Comments

Mark, are you using KymaConnect 2? (as per this thread https://kyma.symbolicsound.com/qa/6475/send-data-from-max-to-kyma)

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Yes, it's KymaConnect 2 - and I did see that. I still have my installer - but as I mentioned same behavior on both my laptop and MacStudio and also with Pacamara and Pacarana (which I expected to ask to update firmware but didn't).

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Mark, how is the IAC port being used with KymaConnect? Perhaps I am misunderstanding your set up but IAC is normally not needed to get MIDI from the Paca(Mara) into Max, or any other application.

KymaConnect's vPacarana virtual port is used to send MIDI to/from applications to the Paca(Mara). This is automatically available if enabled in KymaConnect, KymaConnect is running and connected. There is no need to create an IAC port and then assign it to one of KymaConnect's EXT MIDI slots.

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That's interesting - I wasn't aware of that. Although I do see the vPacarana port in Max... I did try sending to Max with the vport enabled in Max with no luck. In KymaConnect the enable v port is checked, but nothing in the  EXT MIDI slots to select (only IAC) - is that also automatic?

This has worked for me for a long time and just suddenly stopped... (I have several performances coming up in the three weeks - so was a bit of performance anxiety).

It's working fine with the Pacamara as a USB MIDI Host - so not a dealbreaker by any means, just trying to make sure I understand what's happening under the hood.

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It is good to hear Mark that the USB approach is working out. Here's some information that may help your trouble shooting.

KymaConnect's two virtual ports (there is a 2nd that works identical but was intended for use with the Haken Editor) are available for use by other applications as long as the vPorts are enabled in the KymaConnect preference pane, and KymaConnect is running (regardless of whether connected to a Paca/Mara or not). The vPorts show automatically, there is nothing else you need to do.

However, if KymaConnect is not running then another application will not show vPacarana as an available MIDI port. Also if you start the application, and then start KymaConnect, the vPacarana port might not be shown as an available port. This depends on the application and whether it has correctly implemented CoreMIDI’s port change  notifications. Applications like Ableton Live and Logic Pro do this well, others may or may not. Applications built upon Max used to have this issue but I do not know the current situation.

I have also observed some applications that do not handle KymaConnect stopping and then restarting if the application is using the vPacarana port. This is a weakness in how the application uses CoreMIDI.

It is best to always start KymaConnect before starting any MIDI application to avoid these potential issues. KymaConnect was designed to always start at login but if you have set it up for manual operation, or you stop it, and then restart it, be aware that you may need to also restart your application(s).

Regarding IAC ports there really is no need to create one for use with KymaConnect, just use the vPacarana port. IAC ports can have their own quirks.   

I ran some quick KymaConnect tests today so that you can have a proof-of-life. These were performed on different Mac/macOS combinations, including a M1 mini running the latest Sonoma release. In all cases the testing was with a Mara running the most recent firmware. I used the MidiMonitor stand-alone application to verify that the Mara was sending MIDI through the vPacarana virtual MIDI port. I also did a much more rigourous check in the studio but the studio is still using Ventura. I do not have much hands on experience with KymaConnect on macOS Sonoma. So while my quick test was encouraging it is only a preliminary result.

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Thank you for taking the time to look into this, and I appreciate the info!

Not in front of it at the moment, but I will do some more digging tomorrow and report back if there's anything unusual. I've always had KymaConnect running from login - but it's possible I toggled it off or started things out of order when I was poking around. It was just weird to me that it suddenly stopped as it did.

Cheers~

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Had a chance to give things a quick spin with your suggestions and to happy to report everything is rock solid as they always have been - both using the vPort and IAC without the Pacamara as USB Host.

Not sure exactly what caused the communication misfire - hadn’t done anything differently, but it’s likely toggling KymaConnect off was the culprit. Strange it happened on two different systems from the start though. In any case I’m going to chalk it up to user error.  

Again I appreciate the time, help and info!!

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Mark, when/where can people hear you perform this piece? Thanks!

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Next one for this piece will be MOXsonic on 3/15. :-)

https://moxsonic.org

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MZ … see you there!